98 Pathfinder Stringer Job

[slewit]

Hi Cracker Larry

I have some older messages to respond to but since you are so quick I will respond to your comments.

First- Your posts are very nice and you know how to use the features of the forum way better then me, so you are teaching me ! It says I exceeded my "quote" limit so look for Italic's below.

I highly recommend Epoxy for repair as this provides the best bonding. The next best is Vinylester Resin.

Me too. I only use epoxy for boats. Polyester is best left to liesure suits. It's not even waterproof.

The polyester in suits is thermoplastic polyester. For boat resin it is the thermoset polyester. Yes VE and epoxy resins are better. But by far most recreational boats are built with Polyester resin. The reason is cost. PE is less then half that of VE and 1/3 that of Epoxy. When used and designed for properly PE laminates will last a really long time. In all these repairs we are working we are seeing PE based hulls from the 60's and 70's The wood is gone, the engine is toast, but the laminate lives on. I once had an industry pro say "We need worms that eats fiberglass, our boats last too long, we need people to buy new boats ".. My boat is a polyester 94 proline 201, I am thinking I will be getting another 20 years of of this boat as it is in fine shape.

The repair is a different situation. Here we really want Epoxy or VE as we need good bonding to the old laminate.

]We have done several race boats and stunt boats that have a suspended cockpit

Yes but that Pathfinder is not one of them. That cockpit deck is not designed to be suspended. Those race and stunt boats were designed from the start with that in mind.

[yottyboy]

It looks like the boat is small enough that the weird stringer in the middle doesn't really come into play supporting the deck. Hardly an issue.

[Chisox]

Gentlemen,

It is apparent that my friend Scott does have a thing or to to say about stringers, support options, hull/deck integrity, usages, etc. I think he has put forth many considerations in stringer design and function that we all can learn from.

We, Pro-Line, buy our stringers from Compsys. We trust them to design stringers for our boats that enable them to be not only solid, seaworthy, and trustworthy for their 10 year hull/deck warranty, but also give our boats the staying power to allow an owner of a used Pro-Line to be able to give her new life via a re-power and a paint job, and enjoy her for 15 more years.

I thank Scott for getting back here on Reel Boating and supporting his product. We have had tremendous results with their stringers and other products (Prisma Beams are EXCELLENT stiffeners!), and we appreciate their expertise. Mark Pidgeon, one of Scott's "right-hand men", has spent countless hours at our plant, usually at night, working with our stringer crew in lamination to get everything right. My hat's off to Mark!

To those who think they have a better way to build production boats, have at it. I don't see many of you who have an opinion out there at IBEX or the other manufacturers shows touting your "new and improved" products. I applaud Scott and his company for doing what they do, not only for us, but for the countless other boat builders that they work with. As he alluded to, we at Pro-Line are saddened by the demise of Century, and, from what he says, Carravelle. For us, yes, you could say, it is less competition. But competition breeds improvements and innovation. More importantly, the demise of the 2 builders puts many boat loving people out of a job, in areas where jobs, regardless of industry, are very hard to come by.

I hope we think about both what Compsys is trying to do, and what our industry is trying to do, in the times we are in.

Bob C

[bly]

Gentlemen,

It is apparent that my friend Scott does have a thing or to to say about stringers, support options, hull/deck integrity, usages, etc. I think he has put forth many considerations in stringer design and function that we all can learn from.

We, Pro-Line, buy our stringers from Compsys. We trust them to design stringers for our boats that enable them to be not only solid, seaworthy, and trustworthy for their 10 year hull/deck warranty, but also give our boats the staying power to allow an owner of a used Pro-Line to be able to give her new life via a re-power and a paint job, and enjoy her for 15 more years.

I thank Scott for getting back here on Reel Boating and supporting his product. We have had tremendous results with their stringers and other products (Prisma Beams are EXCELLENT stiffeners!), and we appreciate their expertise. Mark Pidgeon, one of Scott's "right-hand men", has spent countless hours at our plant, usually at night, working with our stringer crew in lamination to get everything right. My hat's off to Mark!

To those who think they have a better way to build production boats, have at it. I don't see many of you who have an opinion out there at IBEX or the other manufacturers shows touting your "new and improved" products. I applaud Scott and his company for doing what they do, not only for us, but for the countless other boat builders that they work with. As he alluded to, we at Pro-Line are saddened by the demise of Century, and, from what he says, Carravelle. For us, yes, you could say, it is less competition. But competition breeds improvements and innovation. More importantly, the demise of the 2 builders puts many boat loving people out of a job, in areas where jobs, regardless of industry, are very hard to come by.

I hope we think about both what Compsys is trying to do, and what our industry is trying to do, in the times we are in.

Bob C

Osprey I thanked scott for comming back and answering the many questions I put forward. I also traveled from South jersey to miami and walked the almost empty isles of IBEX. it was pretty sad that someone like myself doing only repairs instead of building boats could command so much time by the powers to be in the booths. I think this economic mess is only going to get worse. Its a shame that many will probably leave the boating community never to return

[Chisox]

...Its a shame that many will probably leave the boating community never to return

How true, but...those of us, and you are truly one of us, will somehow manage to not only survive, but prosper in the buisness of "building boats" in these times. Maybe in a different form, or a different fashion...

Jimmy, right?

Bob C

[Cracker Larry]

Scott, thanks for your very good reply. As I said from the start, I think it is a good product for certain applications. Would you send me some technical information so I can study it further?

Cracker Built Custom Boats

1448 Clyo Shawnee Rd.

Clyo, GA 31303

We, Pro-Line, buy our stringers from Compsys. We trust them to design stringers for our boats that enable them to be not only solid, seaworthy, and trustworthy for their 10 year hull/deck warranty, but also give our boats the staying power to allow an owner of a used Pro-Line to be able to give her new life via a re-power and a paint job, and enjoy her for 15 more years.

You didn't hear me talk down Proline. They do build very good production boats. Better than most.

To those who think they have a better way to build production boats, have at it.

I sure don't, that's why I build custom, one at a time, to a niche market. It's extremely difficult to build a good production boat at a price that the market will accept, while keeping quality high, costs contained and still make a profit. I applaud any company that can survive in todays market and turn out a good product. Certainly new technologies go a long way towards making this achievable.

Companies that survive will have to be lean, flexible and innovative, and use materials such as those stringers that will lower labor and material costs while maintaining quality. Again, I was not questioning the Compsys product, just the method of repair in that PF.

Thanks all for a good discussion, I wish you much success. Heck, I just hope you and I survive (in business) the next few years until this mess turns around!

Larry

[slewit]

Scott, thanks for your very good reply. As I said from the start, I think it is a good product for certain applications. Would you send me some technical information so I can study it further?

Cracker Built Custom Boats

1448 Clyo Shawnee Rd.

Clyo, GA 31303

We, Pro-Line, buy our stringers from Compsys. We trust them to design stringers for our boats that enable them to be not only solid, seaworthy, and trustworthy for their 10 year hull/deck warranty, but also give our boats the staying power to allow an owner of a used Pro-Line to be able to give her new life via a re-power and a paint job, and enjoy her for 15 more years.

You didn't hear me talk down Proline. They do build very good production boats. Better than most.

To those who think they have a better way to build production boats, have at it.

I sure don't, that's why I build custom, one at a time, to a niche market. It's extremely difficult to build a good production boat at a price that the market will accept, while keeping quality high, costs contained and still make a profit. I applaud any company that can survive in todays market and turn out a good product. Certainly new technologies go a long way towards making this achievable.

Companies that survive will have to be lean, flexible and innovative, and use materials such as those stringers that will lower labor and material costs while maintaining quality. Again, I was not questioning the Compsys product, just the method of repair in that PF.

Thanks all for a good discussion, I wish you much success. Heck, I just hope you and I survive (in business) the next few years until this mess turns around!

Larry

Hi Larry

Thank you.. I always like a lively and constructive discussion.

I will send you out a sample kit of our products.

I would like to get your thoughts on our "Prisma TA" product line. Here we custom produce to your exact height and dead rise angle. Parts are 3" thick and 8 ft long. Glass and tabs included. This product won the IBEX innovation award this year for best boat building product. The idea is to be able to supply custom product cost effectively for a single boat. So far I have been hearing that the price ends up not that different from wood and saves a lot of time and weight.

I will include a TA sample. I would value your thoughts.

BOB- PLEASE CHECK OUT THE ATTACHED "TA" PRESS RELEASE !

press release prisma ta.pdf

PRISMA TA FINALrev.pdf

Our TA line is named in honor of the late Tony Adams. Tony worked for us and started us in repair. He appeared on ship shape TV (see our website for link to youtube). Tony worked at Proline prior to working for us and he built my Proline 201. Tony was a lifelong dedicated boat builder who loved to see how innovation could improve boats.

Scott

[Chisox]

Larry,

I understand your business and what type of product you are building as well as the audience/client you are targeting. I applaud you for your work, and, as a matter of fact, are a bit envious of you!

Unfortunately, in the production world, especially in these difficult times, we have to pare our costs down to a minimum so that we can reduce our prices, and therefore, hopefully, sell some boats. Using a product such as Compsys stringers is one of the ways that allow us to do that without sacrificing quality. Having a company build all of our harnesses and switch panels is another. My specialty being electrical, there are many things I would do differently from our supplier, and I do my best to convey the way I want things done to them. But, due to cost constraints, I can't always get what I want. Such is the business these days.

I wish you the best in your efforts, as I hope you wish us the best in "staying alive" in these times. To see long time competitors (and friends) fall by the wayside is quite disheartening, yet, one has to have the belief that things will get better.

[Cracker Larry]

Thanks Scott, I'd like to see some samples for sure. That's a very nice website! If I can save weight, time and money, without a decrease in boat quality then it's a valuable product worth consideration. I won't sacrifice quality to save anything. As a one-off custom builder, quality is my only selling point, I can't compete with production boats in price, and don't try to.

Osprey, I understand full well what you are saying. We are on opposite ends of the building spectrum, but we can sure learn from and support each other.

Larry

[Chisox]

Thanks Scott, I'd like to see some samples for sure. That's a very nice website! If I can save weight, time and money, without a decrease in boat quality then it's a valuable product worth consideration. I won't sacrifice quality to save anything. As a one-off custom builder, quality is my only selling point, I can't compete with production boats in price, and don't try to.

Osprey, I understand full well what you are saying. We are on opposite ends of the building spectrum, but we can sure learn from and support each other.

Larry

:605_thumbs_up: